by Jared Keever

Author’s Note: The name Tony Harris, as mentioned in the following story, is fictitious. In the interest of privacy, and because I have not personally spoken to some of them for many years, I have also changed the names of my own friends mentioned in the story.

aau27It seems strange now, after all that happened, but what I remember most about Herb Baumeister was the absurd, white Land Rover — complete with cargo rack — that he drove around my hometown of Westfield, Indiana. In the flatlands of the Midwest, it was unnecessary. As an ostentatious vehicle, I guess it served its purpose, but it was over the top for affluent, but understated, Hamilton County.

I remember seeing it parked in front of Marlow’s Cafe most Saturday mornings during the mid 1990s, back when I was in high school. Occasionally I would glimpse Herb, wearing an equally absurd Panama hat, walk to the truck with his wife Julie and drive off.

Marlow’s was just around the corner from my father’s hardware store, where I worked on Saturdays during the school year and most weekdays during the summer. The Baumeisters seemed, for a time, to have made Saturday morning breakfasts at the little cafe a regular thing — driving there each week from their 18-acre estate on the southern edge of town.

There wasn’t much strange about that, other than Land Rover. Had the truck not looked so silly parked on the suburban street, I probably would never have known Herb ever ventured into town. But one day the Land Rover stopped showing up. I don’t remember when, exactly, and I don’t recall ever noting its absence.

I certainly wouldn’t remember it today if Herb Baumeister hadn’t turned out to be a serial killer who preyed on the gay men of Indianapolis.

aau11Police now attribute at least 11 murders to his name and suspect he may well have been the serial killer known as the “I-70 Killer” who took nine other male victims on the interstate highway between Columbus, Ohio and Indianapolis.

I knew who Herb Baumeister was before all of that though. That’s because Westfield was a small town.

I graduated from the town’s high school in 1997 with just over 100 students in my class.

Baumeister’s kids attended Westfield schools until high school when, like many students from the wealthier families, they were sent to one of the private schools in Indianapolis, just a 20-minute drive south on U.S. 31.

His oldest daughter was a year younger than me. My sister knew her. His younger son was good friends with my friend Brad’s younger brother.

The Baumeister family was only on my periphery. But I still remember what happened. Most who lived in Westfield at the time do too.

aauI don’t know exactly how I first found out. I have tried to remember, and can’t. But at some point during the summer of 1996, people in town learned that police, while conducting a ground search at the Baumeister estate, had found human remains scattered on the property behind the house.

The news travelled fast. It made the newspapers and the nightly news shows. News trucks parked along both sides of 156th Street, just outside the entrance to the property known as Fox Hollow Farm.

That area, south and west of downtown Westfield, borders the larger and more affluent city of Carmel. Fox Hollow Farm was one of the area’s many horse farms — large, wooded properties usually surrounded by a low, brown wooden fence. Baumeister’s estate was no exception. The Tudor style home sat back off the road and boasted an indoor swimming pool. There were riding stables on the property.

aau14For summer work, many of my friends worked on some of the larger horse farms. They had what I thought was the dream summer job, working outside every day bailing hay, mowing grass, and cleaning fence rows.

Two of my good friends John and Phillip, worked on a farm adjacent to Fox Hollow Farm.

After the initial discovery of bones by the police, authorities swarmed the property, conducting an archaeological-style survey, searching for more remains.

While that was going on, John and Phillip found a few bones in a swale that ran between Fox Hollow Farm and the farm where they worked. They pointed police in the direction of their discovery. They would later tell a group of our friends that their grisly find kept the investigation going and led to the discovery of additional victims.

At the time, though, Baumeister wasn’t being investigated for murder. Police maintained, as they continued their gruesome discoveries, that they were merely investigating the disposal of human remains on the property.

But people, including John and Phillip, were convinced Herb Baumeister had murdered the men whose bones now littered the back acres of Fox Hollow Farm.

aau22Herb gave them both the creeps. He had hired my two friends in the summer of 1995 to do some mowing on the property. Phillip said in a recent email he remembered Herb just stood behind the house, watching them the whole time while they worked.

Herb approached the two in 1996, before police found the bones, and asked them to repeat their summer work. Remembering their uneasy feeling from the previous summer, they declined the offer.

Summer meant I spent most days in town, working for my father. As more and more bones were discovered, the police called in off-duty officers and fire fighters to help with the digging. I remember seeing them in town during lunchtime, eating at Marlow’s or the cafeteria next to my dad’s store. They didn’t say much about the ongoing investigation as they walked to and from their cars, just that they were working on “that property south of town.” I seem to recall selling them a few shovels.

aau15But as the body count grew, police decided they wanted to question Herb. He had been out of town, visiting family in northern Indiana. Before they were able to get to him, though, he slipped over the border into Canada. He was later found dead, in an Ontario park, of an apparent self-inflicted gunshot wound.

It was about the same time news of his death reached Westfield, that people in town learned police had discovered at least eight bodies on Fox Hollow Farm. That number would later grow to 11.

The suicide meant there wouldn’t be a trial. And for some time, it seemed the story of what happened out at the farm might never get told. But as in most small towns, it didn’t take long for the rumors to start circulating

Officials from the sheriff’s office and members of the investigation team said Baumeister had staged a sort of sexual playground around his indoor swimming pool. There were stories that the pool area was surrounded by mannequins, posed in sexual positions. Most believed that the pool was where the murders took place. They said Herb was picking up gay men in Indianapolis and bringing them back to his home, while his family was away, and getting those men drunk, having sex with them and ultimately strangling them.

Rumors spread that the bodies had been dismembered, burned and buried in shallow graves in the woods behind the house.

Brad, my friend whose brother knew Herb’s son and played in those very woods, told us that Baumeister’s son had found a skull a few years prior to police showing up on the property. The son, it was said, took the skull to his mom who confronted Herb with it. Herb told her the skull came from old research skeleton that had belonged to his father, who was a doctor.

I remember the night Phillip and John told us about the bones they found. A group of about six of us were gathered in Phillip’s backyard. It was late, and we were probably planning an early morning fishing trip. When the conversation turned to Baumeister, it took on a hushed tone like we were telling a ghost story.

aau23That’s how the whole thing felt at the time — like a real-life ghost story we had brushed up against.

We speculated that night about what Brad’s brother must be feeling, knowing he had played in and around Baumeister’s makeshift graveyard.

Our proximity to the horror made it all the more exciting. We didn’t question if the stories were true. For a while it was as if the stories my friends and I were telling each other had their own energy, compelling that they be told. Truth was irrelevant. The retelling of each tale made those few weeks seem all the more interesting and haunted.

aau10But I had grown up working in a small-town hardware store listening to small-town liars tell small-town lies. I knew how simple stories could get blown out of proportion. There was always, through that whole summer, a very small voice in the back of my head telling me it couldn’t be as bad as they said it was.

The summer ended, school started and eventually my friends and I graduated and went separate ways. I never forgot Baumeister. Occasionally I would tell the stories to some new acquaintance or a crowd gathered at a college party, but I always wondered, at least for a few years, if I was repeating lies.

I wasn’t.

aau3Now we all know what happened. The story has been told by reporters and those who worked on television documentaries and even by two authors — Fannie Weinstein and Melinda Wilson — who wrote a book about the Baumeister case titled Where the Bodies are Buried.

Numerous online sources, relying on Bodies and a lengthy interview with Indianapolis private investigator Virgil Vandagriff, retell the Baumeister story. All of the details match, almost exactly, to those I learned that summer before my senior year of high school.

That police ever wound up at Baumeister’s door can be attributed, mostly, to the bravery or foolishness of one gay man who is identified in those stories by the name “Tony Harris” — a name that was created to protect his identity.

aau5Harris contacted Vandagriff in 1994 because he knew the investigator was looking into the disappearances of at least three men who had vanished from the Indianapolis gay bar scene. One of those men was Harris’ friend, Roger Goodlet. Harris told Vandagriff that he believed a slightly built man who went by the name “Brian Smart” had abducted and possibly murdered Goodlet.

His proof was a fantastic story about allowing himself to be picked up from a bar by Smart and taken to a secluded home north of Indianapolis.

Harris told Vandagriff that Smart had taken him to a home, on a large piece or property, where they had “partied” around an indoor pool surrounded by mannequins. Harris said he refused a drink made by Smart, but believed Smart had used cocaine while at the home.

The two engaged in erotic asphyxiation as Harris danced dangerously close to his own murder. Harris did it all, he said, because he was trying to find out more about this man who he believed had given him a fake name. He said Smart had given him the creeps and talked about his sexual fantasies. Harris allowed Smart to choke him during sex. That might have been his end had he not feigned unconsciousness causing Smart to loosen his grip.

Eventually, Harris said, Smart passed out and he searched the home, which was obviously inhabited by a family.

aau13That didn’t match the story Smart had told him about watching an empty house while living in the basement near the pool. When Smart woke up, Harris convinced him to take him back to Indianapolis.

He left the home convinced he had spent the evening in the company of a man capable of murder. His only problem was, he didn’t know where he had been.

The back roads just off U.S. 31 are dark and they all look the same, especially at night. Twenty years ago it would have been worse. If Smart had gotten off the highway well south of Fox Hollow Farm it is entirely possible that Harris would not have known which cross street he was on.

The story was compelling for Vandagriff who had already decided the men he was investigating had probably fallen victim to a serial killer. But without knowing Brian Smart’s true identity or where Harris had been that creepy night by the pool, the story was of little use.

It took nearly a year before Harris saw Brian Smart again. But when he did, he got the license number of the car Smart drove away from the bar.

That number gave Vandagriff the name of Herb Baumeister and led him and Indianapolis police investigators to Fox Hollow Farm. By then, it was 1995.

aau25Police first approached Baumeister at one of his Sav-a-Lot thrift stores. That was the chain of children’s clothing stores — unrelated to the supermarkets that go by the same name — that Herb ran with his wife. The police asked Herb if they could search his Westfield property. He refused.

Police then approached Julie asking for permission, but she had been coached by her husband to refuse the request.

aau2It wasn’t until six months later that Julie relented and let police conduct a ground search of the estate. Herb was out of town with his son. The always-fragile marriage was, again, on the rocks and a divorce seemed imminent. Julie said she had grown concerned by Herb’s erratic behavior and was becoming suspicious so she decided to let police conduct their search.

It was June 1996 and police almost immediately discovered the bones.

Now, almost 20 years later, the old news articles and old interviews that I wanted to believe, and went ahead and repeated, have all been proven true.

The stuff about the mannequins and the sexual playground was confirmed by Tony Harris’ chilling experience.

aau12The unbelievable story about Herb Baumeister explaining away the presence of a human skull in his backyard? Julie Baumeister told that story herself, on the record, more than once.

John and Phillip finding those additional bones? Had I added that to make my own retelling of the story more interesting? Had I told the lie so many times that I now believed it? I emailed Phillip recently to check. I just asked him to tell me what he remembered. He confirmed every one of my recollections.

That he and John got the creeps that summer of 1995 certainly doesn’t seem silly in retrospect.

Julie even went on the Oprah Winfrey Show and told her story of living with Herb.

The story that has now emerged, told mostly by Julie herself, is that Herb was always erratic. She said they had sex fewer than 10 times during the course of their decades-long marriage. She said he never allowed her to see him naked because he was embarrassed by his scrawny body. And it was later reported Herb was diagnosed as schizophrenic as a child but never treated.

aau20Julie Baumeister said she and the children spent a good deal of time away from the home. Herb often stayed behind, sometimes to tend to the couple’s business and sometimes because the couple was arguing. She said she accepted the story about the skeleton because she had other things going on in her life. She never gave it another thought.

As his life and marriage began unravel in 1995 and 1996, Herb grew more violent with his store employees and they suspected he was drinking heavily during the day. The business was failing.

After he slipped into Canada, he was questioned by an Ontario Provincial Police officer who approached his car because it was parked under a bridge. Baumeister told the officer he was a tourist and had grown tired and was just catching a quick nap. That officer later said Baumeister had a stack of videotapes in the back of his car.

Harris suspected Smart had a hidden video camera trained on the pool area the night he visited. And some speculate those tapes were recordings of Baumeister’s murders.

They were not in the the car when Canadian police later discovered his body.

aau21His suicide note did not mention the bodies found on the property or that he was suspected of murder. It only mentioned his failing business and marriage, citing those as the reasons for his suicide.

Police later said they found the remains of 11 bodies at Fox Hollow Farm. Only eight of those bodies were ever identified. They all belonged to gay men, known to have disappeared from Indianapolis.

When police developed the theory that Baumeister was responsible for the nine men left along I-70, Julie confirmed that Herb had travelled that route, for business, over 100 times during the period of time the murders were thought to have occurred.

aauFox Hollow Farm is still there. The sign bearing its name still sits on 156th Street marking the entrance to the estate.

Many of my friends from those days, like me, have moved away from Westfield. Many of our parents, who lived there because it had good schools and was a good place to raise children, have also moved on.

My family is still there.

Westfield is more populated than it was in the 1990s. I don’t recognize parts of my hometown these days.

I was there recently for Christmas. As I drove the once empty backroads that are now lined with crowded housing subdivisions I wondered how many zip past Fox Hollow Farm without ever realizing what happened there.

Herb Baumeister’s known victims: Johnny Bayer, 20; Allen Wayne Broussard, 28; Roger A. Goodlet, 33; Richard D. Hamilton, 20; Steven S. Hale, 26; Jeff Allen Jones, 31; Michael Kiern, 46; Manuel Resendez, 31

Richard Hamilton -- 20 years old

Richard Hamilton — 20 years old

Alan Broussard -- 28 years old

Alan Broussard — 28 years old

Roger Allen Goodlet -- 34 years old

Roger Allen Goodlet — 34 years old

 

Manuel Resendez -- 31 years old

Manuel Resendez — 31 years old

Steven hale -- 26 years old

Steven hale — 26 years old

 

Sources:

Herb Baumeister — The Dark Side — Crime Library

Herbert Richard Baumeister | Murderpedia, the encyclopedia of murderers

While Julie Was Away : People.com

 

Click here to view Jared Keever’s previous post:

Up Close and Personal: Tracking the Daytona Beach Serial Killer

About Jared Keever: Jared is a full-time writer and journalist living in southeast Georgia. He has lived in Indiana, Montana, Washington state, and Florida. His interests include history, literature and true crime. When he isn’t reading or writing he is usually on a bike or spending time with his family. 

 

 

 

 

42 Responses to The Secret at Fox Hollow Farm: Herb Baumeister Murdered and Buried 11 Gay Men on His Indiana Country Estate

  1. Kate says:

    To this day, I still cannot fathom how Julie was so oblivious to what was going on.

  2. Dave says:

    Under pressure from the Indianapolis gay community, the Indianapolis police asked the Hamilton County Sheriff’s office to take a look and and later, to question Herb. The Sheriff’s reply was “I can’t do that! He is a successful Hamilton County Businessman! I can’t question him.” So 2-3 more went missing before Indianapolis police had the evidence to search.

    Also, the rumor that dogs in the nearby neighborhood of higher density housing had lost their taste for dog food and were turning on their masters appears to be completely unfounded. The story said that the dogs had become used to regular feedings on the human remains Herb had so carelessly buried in the backyard.

    • Jerry Emery says:

      Lazy cops in Indy should have went out themselves to question him. It wasn’t the Hamilton County sheriff’s job. They certainly had more staffing than he did. Don’t try to lay it all on him.

  3. Rick says:

    Very compelling post, Jared! Thanks for allowing it to be posted on ATCB.

    reminded me of a long-forsuppressed

    Having also grown up in the Midwest (Cedar Rapids, Iowa), your story jogged my memory of the mysterious disappearance of Lynn Schuller, a wife and mother of a three-year old son only 2 blocks from my childhood home on August 6, 1972. The inset of the map in the Cedar Rapids Gazette article showing where Lynn disappeared even shows the street on which I lived — Orrian Drive. See http://iowacoldcases.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/1992-3-19-MMU-2pgs.pdf. That home also had dense woods behind it. The sheriff didn’t believe the story of her husband (Keith Schuller), a somewhat creepy guy, that Lynn was sleeping when he and his son had left home at 7:30 a.m. on August 6. When they returned home 5 hours later, Lynn and her bicycle were missing. Keith claims that he left a note for his wife and went swimming with his son at a local public pool. According to Keith, when they came back one hour later, Lynn’s bicycle was back in the garage but she was nowhere to be found. Nothing was missing from the house or otherwise disturbed.

    Later that day, Keith called Lynn’s parents and others to report her disappearance. A few searches of the area by Keith turned up nothing. The following day, Keith called the Sheriff’s Department to report the disappearance of his wife. A more extensive search of the woods was conducted with dozens of volunteers. Keith declined to join in that search, ostensibly because he had conducted his own searches and found nothing.

    Keith owned a 6-foot long pet alligator named Pogo (John Gacy’s clown calling?) and several snakes. A rumor started that Keith had cut up his wife into pieces and fed it to his alligator and snakes. The police discounted that possibility, however, because the reptiles were too small to devour a human body. They instead focused their efforts on searching the woods behind the house and the house, after obtaining a search warrant to do so. Authorities even took aerial photos of the woods behind the Schuller home in an attempt to identify recently dug-up ground. However, no trace of Lynn was ever found.

    Without a body and no visible signs of any violent struggle, the sheriff never charged Mr. Schuller with any crime. He continued to live in the house with his son for the next several years, which we assiduously avoided when trick-or-treating at my parents’ insistence. Keith eventually moved away from the neighborhood, possibly because people in the area innately knew what law enforcement could never prove (that he was a killer), and he may have gotten away with murder. According to the linked article (now some 23 years old), Keith lived in Fruitland, Idaho where he was a 6th grade teacher.

    Another somewhat unusual aspect of this crime story is that, shortly after Lynn disappeared, Keith filed for divorce in Linn County on the grounds that she had deserted him. When Lynn’s parents hired an attorney to represent her in that case, Keith dropped the case. Lynn’s parents claim that Keith filed for divorce in Linn County a total of seven times and that he dismissed the case each time, after they had entered the case on Lynn’s behalf. Lynn’s parents had sought to compel Keith to testify under oath about the circumstances of his wife’s disappearance. Keith finally obtained a divorce from Lynn in July 1976, only by filing his case some 100 miles away, in Dubuque County, without the knowledge of Lynn’s parents. In March 1978, a Dubuque County judge granted Keith’s request to have Lynn declared legally dead, with their son as the sole heir of her life insurance policy and Keith as the conservator. Keith later married a woman who he met in Cedar Rapids BEFORE Lynn’s disappearance. That marriage eventually ended in divorce.

    As with your story, this goes to show you that living in a small town is no guarantee of safety. :) No one is completely immune from crime, even in Americana. :(

  4. […] also grown up in the Midwest (Cedar Rapids, Iowa), Jared Keever’s excellent post, The Secret at Fox Hollow Farm: Herb Baumeister Murdered and Buried 11 Gay Men on His Indiana Country…, reminds me of the mysterious disappearance of Lynn Schuller, a wife and mother of a three-year old […]

  5. […] The Secret at Fox Hollow Farm: Herb Baumeister Murdered and Buried 11 Gay Men on His Indiana Country… […]

  6. james says:

    I am a retired Indianapolis police officer. I used to work nights in the area around the Our Place gay bar on East 16th Street and North Alabama Street during the time Herb was most active. On the weekends, the place was busy and the parking lots were packed with nice cars with out of county plates, usually driven by middle aged men. The bar itself was very low maintenance from a law enforcement perspective and I was rarely called there for any problems. I was not aware of Herb until I heard on the news about the bones turning up on his farm and his suicide. I often wondered if I ever saw Herb leave the bar with one of his potential victims.

  7. zack shafr says:

    what is the address to Fox Hollow Farm i cant find it any were

  8. Melissa says:

    I went on a hunt there back in Oct. We used a spirit box to communicate with the spirits. Herb came through. Every time one of the spirits came through Herb would come in over their voice. We went in the basement and my name came across the spirit box. All I was doing was snapping pictures. I captured lots of orbs. Then orbs look different than dust particles.

    • Kellie Ward (paraisters) says:

      My team and i are going to be investigating here next month and are super excited! Someone on our team loves anything that deals with murders! So we should really use the SB7?

      • Janie says:

        Yes! Definitely use the SB7. I haven’t yet investigated Fox Hollow, as my team is in Northern Mi but we almost always can get EVPS through it.

      • Bill says:

        I’ve seen a couple of TV programs on Fox Hollow Farm recently. It caught my attention because they talked to the current owner who turned out to be someone I worked with in the 90s. I doubt he is still the owner as I’ve read that the place is on the market for just over a million dollars. The owner’s wife reported seeing a figure standing near the edge of the woods. The renter, however, said that the ghost of Baumeister tried to choke him while he was in the pool.
        Fox Hollow Farm is on the west side of the Monon Trail at 156th Street in Westfield, Indiana. Since I ride the Monon on my bike I decided to take a ride through the property. It’s well taken care of and horses are still being boarded. Two cars were parked there but no one responded when I yelled through an open garage door and talked into the security cam. I don’t think my friend still lives there.

    • Eric Hardy says:

      How do you get permission to investigate there?

  9. Fox Hollow Farm says:

    To Bill from the comment on 09/30. Not sure if I know you or not, but please don’t come on the property without permission. We have a lot of trespassers and do not hesitate to call the Westfield police. I never know the intent of someone walking up to the house uninvited.

    • I dont blame you that would make me super uneasy! You have the history of the farm to deal with not to mention people creeping around for God knows what reason. So not cool. I can imagine the extra stress all of that brings on. Some people clearly do not think.

    • Not A. Skeptic says:

      I’m sorry but, you have to expect people to enter your property without permission. The property has history and people are curious.

      • Amityville says:

        Agreed. When you buy a notorious crime scene at a discount… it’s because the Ghost of Baumeister still owns the majority share of the property! You got a “GOOD DEAL” because trespassers will inevitably be visiting to hunt for bones and spirits.

        • Lee says:

          They got the house at a discount because it was left to rot and full of mold and wildlife.

        • sheila says:

          There is a difference between understanding that you bought a notorious property and that people will want ot come look around, and those same curious people repeatedly trespassing despite having been directly told “Do not come on my property without permission”. As the property owners, they have a legal right to ask people to wait for permission (and anyone with decent Theory of Mind should be able to understand how much random trespassers would freak out the owners of a notorious murder site and possible freaking.haunted.house). They should expect that people will *want* to come look, of course, but those other people do not actually have a legal *right* to come and look without permission regardless of how infamous the site is.

          Like, cool motive, dude, still trespassing.

          Why can’t you guys just do the polite thing and ask first?

      • Jerry Emery says:

        Then you should probably expect to get shot at during your trespassing if that is your attitude. SMH.

  10. Arthur Rosenbarger says:

    A great friend, and ex lover of mine, was Herbs hairdresser. I never met him but I had met his wife, Julie once at the salon. My ex said that Herb was kinda dirty and weird acting one time. And had dirt under his fingernails etc. And he said he had been doing yard work etc….I just think the whole story, sounds like it would be a great Horror Movie…..

  11. I watched a few stories about this article.I watched the ghost adventures program on this story also, and paranormal witness. I honestly do believe that the fox hollow farm is very haunted because of what went on there.I would love to go there with my P-SB11 ghostbox and do some serious investigating!

  12. Matt says:

    I live extremely close to the property. I have strange things actually occurring in my home. Pretty certain it’s not from Herb or any victims tho. Person who had this house before us passed away at a very young age.. If anyone at the current estate is reading this.. Waving from Moontown rd!! God bless.

  13. Janie says:

    I’m sorry but even though people are curious they still don’t have the right to trespass. If I were the new owner I wouldn’t want people snooping around without prior permission either. That’s all they need is some idiot snooping around, tripping and getting hurt then trying to sue them for it. It’s sad but true.

  14. Tony Harris says:

    Please know that the stories are true. The home/property was haunted while Herb lived and is much more active presently than ever before. I am alias Tony Harris. I do assure you the specters were there when Herb took me there and Herb and I did discuss the spirits. Presently I have agreed to seek on the matter. This will be the first time since Herb’s death that I have been interviewed. All other interviews were given as an effort to bring Herb to justice. Please have respect for these victims. Say a prayer for them. Tell them of God’s great love for them. Explain to them that all may be forgiven. Do this now from your location. Thank you and God bless. M.E.

    • Lee says:

      I hope that you’ve had someone to talk to these past 20 years, M.E., even if those conversations didn’t happen in public.
      Horrible thing you were a witness to.
      God bless.

  15. Tony Harris says:

    Please friend and visit Fox Hollow. Fb. Page. We would like to compile an account of persons whom might have memories of friends and/or loved ones that were involved.

  16. Ocenbrz says:

    I just read a comment from Van dagriff noting Herb might have murdered his older brother. The MO follows his later crimes. This should be investigated since it is quite possible that what created Herb could have been his older brother being a rapist or at the very least sexually experimenting with his younger brother. Or …when Herbs homosexual tendencies become evident his older brother might have bullied him leading to his death.

    In trying to understand what leads people to this kind of behavior it is very important to find the real root cause of his motivation for his crimes. Because it was so distinct. Seeing how Herb first lured his victims to choke him before using the same tactic on his victims seems to point in the direction of early sexual misdirection.

    Though his only motivation to murder his victims rather then just engage in homosexual affairs seem to be to conceal his behavior from his wife and the public.

    I just feel it is important to establish the effects of early abuse on a child’s mental health. If this was the real trigger it will help mental health experts and child protection services, as well a doctors to look into this direction when psychological problems manifest themselves in children and young adults.

    It is important to know this information to help treat victims before their abuse might manifest itself into homicidal behavior. Not ignoring the fact that our societies refusal to understand homosexual behavior as being natural in some human beings have wrongly put homosexuals into the same category as such undesirables as rapist and murderers. I can attest to constantly being battered by pulpits of all of the major religions of this harmful abuse of otherwise non-violent people. As well as seeing repeatedly growing up the bullying of anyone who seemed to fit into the imagined homosexual stereotype.

    It is just important for people to realize where some of this hatred and disassociation came from and the part many of us played in enabling this terrible abuse to create monsters out of human beings. The same can be said about how society has treated children and rape victims. The blame always falls on the victim before it ever attempted to punish the guilty.

    I hope by sharing these cases people will start realizing their part in building up the power and confidence in these kind of dangerous criminals. It is still too common for people to openly praise or collect and/or by redistribute the sexually abusive pornography of these criminal’s the accomplishments of those people who sexually or violently exploit people. You see this when even our youth are more likely to pass along or praise a rapist, exploit a victim, even pay more money to ruin a child for their pleasure.

    There is still a lot wrong with the human race. It is up to us to do a lot more to give children an escape from abuse as well as putting a lot more emphasize on singling out children with behavior difficulties to help them avoid becoming another Herb Baumeister.

    Another important point needs to be made. Most of the parents who abuse children or have family members who are abusing their children will not seek help to protect these children. So it is a waste of time and money to give them rights when they refuse to protect their children from harm. So I applaud that program in Norway that removes children first from abusive parents and then puts those parents through education programs. We are not going to put a dent in serious crime as long as we keep letting abusive parents to have access to children.

    It seems obvious there was some abusive behavior in Baumeister’s home. Whether it came from his brothers or neglect by his emotionally effected mother? That is a mystery begging to be solved. I hope his children received some therapy and their mother some mental health intervention. Her failure to act against his bad behavior or accept her husbands abuse was not an acceptable response or that of a mother concerned about how their constant fighting was not a threat to the well-being of their children. Of course we do not need another generation of messed up adults from this family.

  17. Ocenbrz says:

    Oh I should say good article. As for all of ghost hunting. Please let the dead rest in peace. Feeding into people’s paranoia about dead people haunting us is not doing anything good for mental health patients. As well as those who have suffered such sad loses of loved ones.

    Your ghost movies are entertaining. That is why I looked up this case. However nothing in it is leading people to discovering the true root causes that make people like Herb Baumeister tick. As well as convince these enabling spouses from reporting abusive behavior to the proper authorities if they really do want to keep their children. Too many times I have heard and my own childhood experience with mom’s boyfriend where mom or pop think it is okay to raise your children in an abusive home because it is BETTER then poverty. No, it isn’t. Children are just as effected by what they see as they are by their parents threatening them to keep secrets about abuse. You are guaranteed at least one of the children will be so mentally damaged that it will turn them against you. As well as a legal systems tired of paying with the well being of their own families so that you can keep breeding for an abusive spouse.

    The shame has to be on the abusers but those who witness their abuse and do nothing or little need to answer to the laws of our land. Failure to report child abuse or spousal abuse will lead to charges against you if your children are being harmed. We have to get past these parents who are making life as a serial killer, rapist manageable because they are benefiting from their support.

    Sure Welfare isn’t fun but putting your children into harms way might mean their growing up to be a criminal. Better to be poor then behind prison bars. The courts and juries are not going to go easy on parents any longer so they need to start doing the right things.

    The fact is that many of other people’s children died because Julie wanted to keep pretending she had a happy home. She needs to live with that fact for the rest of her life. I hope she finds some ways to make amends to their families and her children for the part she played in this terrible drama.

    And prayer doesn’t count. And any gods that let other people suffer and die like this do not deserve to be worshiped. The devil is us when we do terrible things. Prayer doesn’t help to stop bad people. People do. So let the dead rest in peace. Put your efforts into helping the living who are suffering from abuse. And educating people about responsibility. There are already too many people selling get out of hell free cards out there. Real peace comes from knowing the truth and teaching others why they need to make better life choices.

  18. Duh says:

    So you’re saying the Herb isn’t responsible, but his wife is for staying? That sounds smart. I am in school for forensic psychology, and he probably would have done this still even if she left. People can come from wealthy and non-abusive houses and still kill people. Let’s put blame where blame is due. He did the killings and took the cowards way out to avoid going to prison. Some man he was.

    • Tony Harris says:

      Please know that many do have this story wrong. I am aliasTonyHarris. It has been my observation that Herb was and is responsible for his actions. Mental illness does not give the sufferer a hall pass to act any way they wish. It is most paramount that family and friends encourage,report,document and yes intervien. I know that Herb was not alone in the Commision of these and other crimes. I have proven this and it is a fact that Herb himself was murdered in Canafa. This story does go on and on. I do indeed disclose proof of what I say in documentation. Herb was very much tormented by those that were murdered. The spirits attached themselves to him while he was alive. I witnessed this phenomenon myself. We have arrived in the age of greater understanding of this dynamic. I will encourage anyone to visit Fox Hollow Farm for themselves and witness this very simple truth. It is very apparent and Fox Hollow Farm itself will wrap itself around you. You will indeed be convinced that the paranormal world does exist. Allow Herb to tell you his story. Allow Herb to confess to murder and even the name (s) of accomplises. This is not a hoax. You will simply realize that you yourself are a very spiritual being. No ceremony involved. Just come on in and sit down to chat. M.E.

  19. Tony Harris says:

    To visit Fox Hollow Farm you should simply mail a letter to 1111 East 156th street I believe it is Carmel Indiana now. This letter might include your contact information so that owners might invite you to attend. Please know that website info remains difficult as many issues have hampered this very controversial property. If you would like to meet with myself please include that request in your corrospondence. My efforts began in 2016 to clarify this story as so very many persons and publications have erroneously reported what is a very factual occurence. Thanks so much. M. E.

  20. Katherine Weinstein says:

    There is also some peace at Fox Hollow Farm. The property in sunlight showcases the pond along the driveway, sometimes with a fishing grey heron and a small red fox in the field to the west. I explored this property before it was purchased by the Graves and enjoyed focusing on the lovely portions of the acreage.

  21. Tony Harris says:

    Ms. Weinstein,
    Please know that at the time you and I spoke on the phone; I was fleeing for my very life possibly my soul. You must understand that the person responsible for Herb’s death was still at large. To say minimally, I was indeed in no condition to divulge anything but what I had already stated to the F.B.I.. Might I please say that you did not hear the entire story. I remain very concerned that your publication and research did not contain any references to any other murderers.
    I deposed to the authorities at that time a description of the person I believed and maintain was the accomplice. This has since been proven. I am very sorry that you and I never had the opportunity to pursue the story further. I am currently interested in a more complete disclosure of my personal documentation as well as a three page letter Herb did leave with me as he had visited my home to in fact murder me before fleeing to Canada. What I am saying is very much proven as fact. Again I suggest any doubters to visit Fox Hollow Farm and ask Herb himself. Thank you very much for allowing me to remain hidden behind my chosen alias Tony Harris.
    M. E.

    • Cory says:

      Absolutely horrifying what you went through. I really hope you have peace and you’re not plagued by nightmares. My heart goes out to you and I’m so glad you didn’t fall victim to this monster. My warmest wishes.

  22. Cory says:

    What I’d like to know is what were the causes of death for these victims? It sounds as if they participated in that dangerous sexual activity and then died as a result. Baumeister then just buried the bodies on his property.

    That farm must be an eerie place at night. I wouldn’t go there if anyone paid me to.

    • Tony Harris says:

      Cory,
      Please know that I was not present at any death. The cause of death for individuals was never determined as no intact bodies were ever recovered. I must use the adage “Herb told me” when discussing cause of death. I am certain there were persons whom died of gunshot wounds as Herb told me there were victims that simply were very difficult for Herb to overpower. You should just ask Herb himself as he does answer questions concerning this matter. I do know a few of the victims very well and even their families. The victims in many instances were drugged then strangled as Herb told me. Please be reminded that Herb’s father was an anesthesiologist and his prescription pads were found in Herb’s possesion at Fox Hollow Farm.
      Wanna sit down and chat about it?
      Send contact info to Graves’ 1111 East 156th Street, Carmel In.
      Herb will be happy to answer your questions.
      This is not a hoax. The place is very haunted.
      M. E.

  23. Chuck says:

    Does anyone or anybody know what kind of vehicles he had owned? From the early 80s

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